Kickstarter King of war 2.0 - Printable Version +- Redditch Tabletop Gamers Forum (https://forum.redditchtabletopgamers.com) +-- Forum: Fantasy and Sci-Fi Miniature Gaming (https://forum.redditchtabletopgamers.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=35) +--- Forum: Other (https://forum.redditchtabletopgamers.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=37) +--- Thread: Kickstarter King of war 2.0 (/showthread.php?tid=2303) Pages:
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King of war 2.0 - manrogue - 04-11-2014 From the latest blog Quote:http://manticblog.com/2014/11/03/big-battles-great-background-quick-rules/ RE: King of war 2.0 - Stuart - 13-11-2014 Kickstarter goes live tomorrow (14th) at 14:30 GMT. RE: King of war 2.0 - Simian - 13-11-2014 Bloody mantic and their Kickstarters. Just release the games! RE: King of war 2.0 - Gareth - 13-11-2014 (13-11-2014, 11:29 AM)Simian Wrote: Bloody mantic and their Kickstarters. Just release the games! I understand that view point, and to a degree I agree. But I have also heard Mantic talk about the concept behind their constant Kickstarter. The best example of this is their 40k equivalent game Warpath. There is a big standard version which has a very limited range of miniatures. In that universe though Dreadball exists, which via its Kickstarter put into place the funding for a large amount of the concept art, for the universe. Then came Deadzone, which via its funding allowed them to cast up a tool, a larger number of moulds meaning that Warpath now has a greater range of miniatures available. They have mentioned that there will probably be another Warpath universe Kickstarter, the intention being to get more moulds produced, this being more likely to feature vehicle. Then finally Warpath gets its Kickstarter, and this time a massive amount of work has been payed for, meaning a much larger game is possible. Yes Mantic have perhaps asked for enough funds in advance, and probably it seems like they have a constant begging bowl, passed about. But for most companies, who rely on finding external tooling, sometimes it is the only way. I will say for Mantic, the nature of their kickstarters, does mess them up, because it does kill off secondary purchases. After all why buy more models for rrp, when they game me everything at 25% retail in the Kickstarter? RE: King of war 2.0 - Simian - 13-11-2014 oh i understand it, i got their email justifying it to me, but i dont agree with it. It kills secondary sales, its constant with them (which is a big part of the issue), they've still not finished sending out the Deadzone models FFS! RE: King of war 2.0 - Gareth - 13-11-2014 So your waiting on Deadzone. What are you expecting them to do in the mean time? Sit about not doing anything, or progress their company? RE: King of war 2.0 - Simian - 13-11-2014 course not. but how about finish one KS before starting another? how about not treating KS as a preorder website? RE: King of war 2.0 - Gareth - 13-11-2014 Here is a tale of two companies. One called Mantic and one called Wyrd. Mantic proposed to release a game, called Kings of War. So they approached the community and asked "here is our vision, who will fund us?" and the community replied we will. They then proposed to release a game called Dreadball, so again they asked the community and asked "here is our vision, who will fund us?" But the community replied "wait a minute, we are still waiting on our Kings of War products, whats going on?" So Mantic replied "thank you for funding our Kings of War project. You will notice that at the moment, we have not missed any of our projected shipping dates on Kings of War. We have paid our concept artists to produce concept art, and they are currently sat about doing nothing. We have paid our rules designers to write rules, and they have honed thme down to a degree we are happy with, but now they are sat about doing nothing.We have paid our sculpters to do our sculpts, which they have but they are currently sat about doing nothing. We are waiting for our miniature producers to produce the miniatures for us, but whilst we wait, we would like to start a new project, utilising the resources we currently have available." So the community agreed this was a wise decission and funded Dreadball. Then Mantic said "Hey community we have an idea for a game, called Deadzone, who wants to help fund it?" And the community said "wait a cotton picking minute, I'm waiting on Dreadball stuff to arrive." So Mantic sat down and explained all of the above again, and the community decided actually Mantic were doing things correctly, and funded Deadzone. In all the time Mantic have asked for Kickstarter funding, they have never massivekly missed their shipping tagets. Then there was a company called Wyrd. Wyrd had a game, called Malifaux, and it was popular. But Wyrd wanted to expand their company and said to the community, "we want an Evil Baby Orphanage." So the community said what a great idea, and it funded EBO, and the community recieved their products earlier than expected. Wyrd then said, "we want a Malifaux roleplay game. However we cannot fund this without your support," and the community said yes.And everything was going well, then after six months Wyrd diverted some of the staff that the Kickstarter had funded for Through the Breach, towards developing M2E. And then Through th Breach missed its completion target by twelve months, because Wyrd decided to divert its funding elsewhere. Now I have no real love for Mantic, I have played one of their games once (a demo of Dwarf Kings Hold, with Ronnie at TWG.) I think their models look garbage, and whiklst I want to play Kings of War, I want to do so, when I get around to painting their models. Which look garbage, so they shift to the back of the queue. Wyrd on the otherhand, I am technically employed by, I love their Malifaux universe to pieces, EBO is one of my favourite games, and despite a v1 preference, I am really lookign forward to playting more M2E. But I know which one of the two game companies acted out of hand, and I know which of the two I trust to deliver products on time. RE: King of war 2.0 - Gareth - 13-11-2014 Ben you replied whilst I was typing my long winded tale. I do agree Kickstarter was never intended to be a pre-order store, but Mantic are not the only ones who have done so. Not just in the minatures community but in other genres also. Is it right? Definately not. Do Kickstarter mind? Definately not. Do you as the consumer are you forced spend any money via Kickstarter? Definately not. Do you as a consumer who has spent money with a company thats used Kickstarter as a pre-order service, have any justifiable right to complain about said company using Kickstarter as a pre-order service? Hint answer has been given to you three times prior. At least in my opinion If you dont like it, dont fund it. With or without this Kickstarter your Deadzone stuff will arrive at the same time. RE: King of war 2.0 - Simian - 13-11-2014 Im not sure what your point is, you seem to be implying i dont have any right to complain about something i dislike? As for me losing that right because i've used the company, i have no real issue when its a new game system, ie Deadzone, Dreadball (the first time), but its the repeat KS for things like Zombiecide or the fact mantic have already announced more dreadball, and more deadzone that the issue for me comes in, those are the types of KS that need to stop being a Preorder service. original game systems are fine. also, i dont have a problem with delays, delays happen, but when they're saying that they're turning over their production to the new KS and ignoring queries about missing KS stuff and not finishing one before moving on it becomes an issue. i also agree the Mantic models are awful. restic is an awful material, i wont be getting anything from Mantic again. |