Intial reactions to 6th edition

[Nick]

my queire with allies is they have their own focre organisation chart is that standalone or with the standard one ie could u take 6 normal troops and then 2 alliy troops or is it 4 troops plus 2 ally troops etc

As far as i understand it, choices from an Allied codex DO NOT take up spaces on your normal force organisation chart. IE you could take 6 Troops choices from your main force, and then 1 HQ and 2 more Troops choices from an allied codex, to make 8 Troops total. Note though that desperate allies do not count as scoring units.

[manrogue]

Yep,your right Nick with the restrictions i put in my post.

[jaqenhgar]

So after my second game of sixth, I need to remember to roll for night fight and mysterious objectives since we forgot. Also I forgot and managed to place more than half my army in reserve (3 DW squads and two characters from a total of nine units), so there's a bit of a limitation there but just requires a bit more thought - I could have left my librarian with the DW squad that deployed normally and it wouldn't have changed the game very much.

My librarian underperformed this time, didn't do much useful and killed himself on a perils, no inv. saves against it. The wound allocation, although it makes my DW squads marginally more vulnerable to shooting, it does mean that the cyclone missile launcher guy survives longer since he's at the back so that's nice, but the same is true for the enemies heavy/special weapons as well.

Vehicles are definitely much easier to kill, glancing AV13 dreads to death in combat with thunder hammers. Tried my ravenwing and they were awesome, and got more survivable to krak missiles and heavy weapons (5+ jink save and T5 on the 2-wound attack bikes), plus I am really liking the pre-measuring.

Also the flyers being in reserve means they are a bit hit and miss, might not come on until turn 3 or 4 and so only get two or so turns of shooting. If you don't have juicy vehicle targets then they are quite easy to ignore with certain armies, as they can't contest objectives (vehicles and hull needs to be within 3" of objective anyway)

[manrogue]

Spotted this post and if true, may make Nick a happy boy again-

Today I attended Games Day Chicago and had a chance to chat with Phil Kelly himself. I mentioned to him my sadness at the lack of a power fist, as our anti-termie combat weapons are limited to the demiklaives. He started to ask me why I just didn't use a huskblade, but stopped himself mid-sentance. A few minutes later, he told me that a new FAQ was on the way. Finally GW has listened to our pleas and brought the feared terminator down a rung in the ladder of brokenness. Almost asked him about Chaos Marines, but decided not to. Would have loved to see his reaction though

[Nick]

Spotted this post and if true, may make Nick a happy boy again-

Today I attended Games Day Chicago and had a chance to chat with Phil Kelly himself. I mentioned to him my sadness at the lack of a power fist, as our anti-termie combat weapons are limited to the demiklaives. He started to ask me why I just didn't use a huskblade, but stopped himself mid-sentance. A few minutes later, he told me that a new FAQ was on the way. Finally GW has listened to our pleas and brought the feared terminator down a rung in the ladder of brokenness. Almost asked him about Chaos Marines, but decided not to. Would have loved to see his reaction though

Finally, i did say that melee was unviable for Dark Eldar with the power weapon nerf and overwatch.

[Embolden]

If I was going for Dark Eldar:

HQ1 : Baron Sathonyx (105) [105]
HQ2 : Haemonculous (50) [50]

Elite1 : 4 Trueborn (48), 4 Blasters (60), Transport 1 [108]
Elite2 : 4 Trueborn (48), 4 Blasters (60), Transport 2 [108]
Elite3 : 4 Trueborn (48), 4 Blasters (60), Transport 3 [108]

Troop 1 : 5 Dark Eldar Warriors (45), Blaster (15), Transport 4 [60]
Troop 2 : 5 Dark Eldar Warriors (45), Blaster (15), Transport 5 [60]
Troop 3 : 5 Dark Eldar Warriors (45), Blaster (15), Transport 6 [60]
Troop 4 : 5 Dark Eldar Warriors (45), Blaster (15), Transport 7 [60]
Troop 5 : 3 Wracks (30) [30]
Troop 6 : 16 Hellions (256), Helliarch (10), Agoniser (15) [281]

HS1: Ravager (105), 3 Dark Lances (0), Night Shields (10) [115]
HS2: Ravager (105), 3 Dark Lances (0), Night Shields (10) [115]
HS3: Ravager (105), 3 Dark Lances (0), Night Shields (10) [115]

Transport 1 : Venom (55), Extra Splinter Cannon (10), Elite1 [65]
Transport 2 : Venom (55), Extra Splinter Cannon (10), Elite2 [65]
Transport 3 : Venom (55), Extra Splinter Cannon (10), Elite3 [65]
Transport 4 : Venom (55), Extra Splinter Cannon (10), Grisly Trophies (5), Troop1 [70]
Transport 5 : Venom (55), Extra Splinter Cannon (10), Grisly Trophies (5), Troop2 [70]
Transport 6 : Venom (55), Extra Splinter Cannon (10), Grisly Trophies (5), Troop3 [70]
Transport 7 : Venom (55), Extra Splinter Cannon (10), Grisly Trophies (5), Troop4 [70]

[TOTAL POINTS - 1,850]

No need for CC as you have 150 poisoned shots, 9 dark lance shots, 16 blaster shots.

To trim to 1750pts, just drop warriors for wracks keeping up the Splinter Cannons shots.

[Nick]

Don't want to play ranged, already been over this with Vince. If i want a shooty army i'll go imp guard (which is in the pipe line) or Eldar or Tau. I like having a bit more balance, and i simply felt that due to the survivabilty nerf for DE that some units, esspecially quite a few that i enjoy using, just were not worth using anymore. That seems to be the difference between our opinions Rob. You make an army to do well, i make an army out of whatever the hell i like, but i don't want to be penalised for my choices simply because i want to play something that isn't viable, or has a playstyle i don't enjoy, due to a new rules edition.

[Embolden]

Nick I'm not really sure what your trying to get at?

In any game, if you play with units that aren't 'viable' I'm not sure what your expecting to do other than lose? It's like me playing with a foot eldar composing of nothing more than banshees and dire avenges then moaning about my army not working?

Not wanting to be disrepecful but how many games of 6th have you played to form opinions of what works and what doesn't? I mean my paladins are looking exctremely strong on paper but got smacked around by Vince and Chris. This gane is not played in paper, It takes game time and real play testing to form a solid opinion of what works and what doesn't.

But I digress, if your not wanting to give it a go then each to there own, I'm loving the fact it's not easy for me to win even if I get battered some more its still extremely fun trying .

[smallpoxeldar]

I agree you need game time to start to form an opinion and I dont play standard tornament lists but I seem to still keep pulling out victory's with dark eldar. Its all about the challenge and having fun in the end. It takes a great general to win with slightly more unsual lists, So what if your win rate drops alittle take the experince and try again.

[jaqenhgar]

I think what Nick is trying to say (correct me if I'm wrong) is he has units he finds more interesting/fun to use but is frustrated that their rules make them less likely to lead to victory. I also find all shooting armies less fun to play than ones with an assault element/heavy on assault. Hence Nick has been put off playing since he will not find it fun anymore, which is a shame but a perfectly valid opinion since fun is subjective, but there are plenty of other games to play out there - too many to play them all! I guess there's nothing stopping people from still playing 5th edition if you can find an opponent that wants to.

Changes to the rules can be frustrating since it makes some units better, some worse and some just different, but personally that gives you the opportunity to bring out those units that have been sitting on the shelf for a while! A change is as good as a rest and all that.

I do agree that part of the fun with 40k is finding what works with both the rules and your own playstyle, and you can only do that by playing some games, things do often work differently than on paper because terrain and the enemies reactions etc play a massive part in how the game goes, rather than 'oh, my army puts out 375 s4 shots so should wipe your army on turn 1' (slight exaggeration here).

As a side-note I thought DE always were primarily a shooty army with some fast but fragile assault elements, but then I have only played them once. They can still assault well (I think overwatch is overhyped and won't make much of a difference most of the time), but not things with a 2+ save, which now need to be exclusively shot unless the unit is severely weakened.

Sorry for the long post I am rambling.

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you could always whip those Blood Angels out Nick - a full jump pack army looks like it'd be awesome and fun to play! (Death company suddenly got a lot better as well)